I have often heard y'all around here talk about "Delta with Gamma tendencies". But I have never heard anyone talk about "tendencies" toward any other kind of rank.
This makes me think that Delta<->Gamma would be more consistently described as a single thing which is a spectrum. Which would make Delta<->Gamma unique among the ranks, which is not very elegant, but still might be true.
On the other hand I also think "Sigma tendencies" and "Omega tendencies" seem credible. But I have never heard anyone else bring them up.
On the other other hand, "tendencies" don't totally make sense in a context in which your place in the hierarchy is determined intersubjectively. Like, the fact that you sometimes have Sigma thoughts while falling asleep makes no impact on how other people perceive you or instinctively rank you relative to themselves and others. And if SSH is seen as an analytical tool to predict human behaviors, well, only some of your behaviors are the kind of thing that anyone would be interested in predicting anyway, and your shower thoughts don't necessarily influence those specific behaviors.
Overall I guess what I find believable about Delta-Gamma is that there is a clear tension which seems true to life. You have a picture of a person, the "high road" available to him, and the "low road" available to him, and both are tempting. You have a personality that is capable of change over time.
What's hard to make sense of with Alphas, Bravos, and Sigmas is the idea implicit in this ranking system that their personality is SO set in stone that they have no significant internal tension. An Alpha will just... always be Alpha, because that's who he is. That is really hard to understand. Someone with no internal tension sounds like someone with no internal monologue - an NPC.
So I guess I'm saying, I think that Alphas and everyone else also experience internal tension. But it seems that only the Delta-Gamma range experience tension which is significant enough to affect their SSH position? Do Alphas experience no "Sigma temptation" or "Bravo temptation"? I dunno.
Vox once wrote, either on Vox Popoli or Alpha Game, that he as a Sigma sometimes has to fight off Omega tendencies so he can be social. The anecdote he used was hanging out in the library by himself while his wife talked to the house guests. That is a more understandable example due to the similarities between Omega and Sigma.
As for Alphas, they will sometimes allow themselves to be relegated to a Bravo role if a more socially powerful Alpha shows up. Alphas don't like having to play "second banana" to a more dominant Alpha if they can avoid it, so you can call that a form of tension that arises situationally.
Its funny because with the incessant inquiry what you almost always have is a horde of Gammas and Deltas asking what profile they are, when its obvious to everyone else.
Precisely. They're constantly trying to identify that one thing that allows them to suspect that they just might possibly be a Sigma. Or, previously, an Alpha.
By this example I’m 100% Sigma. When I first got together with my wife she had a terrible temper and would throw all these insults and accusations and more. Within a year I had completely broken her of these terrible emotional attacks. I retrained to not let herself become out of her mind emotionally angry. I got her to the point she would approach me and first tell me how she was emotionally upset and how it was completely illogical it was. Then she would either tell me directly what the real issue was or ask me to help her figure out what the real issue was. Her family was completely amazed I had tamed her often violent temper. As I cannot self define what I am I have no idea if others would see me as Sigma. It’s nothing I worry about but it is an interesting thought.
The Gamma only stews about it for weeks? That’s an optimistic timeframe. Years later the Gamma will corner unwilling listeners to tell them this woeful tale of betrayal. A 2 second incident turns into a 20 minute story. “He knew damn well what my name was. He said it wrong on purpose because he’s afraid of me. He had to show everyone around him what a big man he was.”
Gotcha and completely understand. I valued it for the exact opposite reason as it's helpful to understand how the various SSH would react to given situations, not to mention you're responses as a Sigma were hilarious.
Huh, I fit the Bravo category on both of these examples. Of course, that alone doesn't imply I'm a Bravo. But it's nice to know I definitely rise past the low/mid Delta in situations like these.
I wonder if Gammas are more or less likely to use LLM's to generate their walls of text. Using them would allow for a higher throughput of wall, but not using them would show off their big brains.
Depending on the situation and the person I would immediately correct them or not care. I'm neither an Alpha or a Sigma, so there is definitely some overlap in the ranks
Is there is no minute imperceptible insignificant perceived slight of a Gamma that won't result in an excruciatingly detailed Wall of Text addressing every possible conceivable injustice one has supposedly committed?
In a spirit of sympathetic honesty, Gammas aren't always primed to recognize a slight or to go off, and that behavior can be subdued with continuing effort. They can also train themselves to make good of that impulse, as gatekeeping or defense of a friend.
But absent that ongoing self-controlling effort, the Gamma will go off given half an excuse; if no excuse can be found, he'll invent one.
Bravos aren't afraid of conflict but the way they approach it is quite different to an Alpha.
They also don't have the delusion bubble some other ranks have. So they are unlikely to pretend they love it.
Best guess is he pressures her to exercise and eat better and makes compliance really easy. For example he will drive her to the gym and take the kids for an hour so she can exercise.
Bravos seem to accumulate attractive female friends, so the wife stays in shape, because she's worried that he'll divorce her for one of these friends, which is true, as his Alpha buddy will knock some sense back into him.
The Bravo would still probably try to communicate to his wife that she was fat and that he wanted to help her lose weight. If she reacted positively, then congrats, the Bravo's wife is losing weight. If she reacted negatively, then he would probably change his behavior and pretend to love it.
Gammas get scammed by those sites, but they rarely get anything more. They only really get the opportunity if they're in positions of prominence, like novel-writing Scientologist or director of feminist television programs.
The way I look at it, Gaiman's passive. He doesn't have the drive to go out and find a woman to be with; he waits for the fates to bring him someone vulnerable to prey upon.
It has nothing to do with the blog, but I don't know where else to ask my question.
How do you deal with a gamma that subjects you to interrogations and exclaims (uhh?!) with anger if you don't answer and that if you ask him a question he pretends that he didn't listen and moans again (uhh!?) so that you repeat what you said , I think it's a way to challenge you and make you angry or feel bad, thank you
It's easy. Stop talking to him. Just ignore him. It's the way you should handle everyone who refuses to accord others the respect they expect themselves.
“you never listen to me!” “you don’t love me!” “you never buy me anything! Do you even care?”
And then the Gamma calls her a slut and a whore and says "you probably loved being ran through by Chad and Connor and they didn't even care about you half as much as I do"
Trying to imagine what my Bravo husband would say if I brought up the fact (and it's true) that he doesn't bring me gifts and flowers. Probably something about how he gives me everything I need, plenty of money, and now I expect him to go pick something out and buy it for me, too?
Usually I tolerate being called the wrong name once or twice and then correct it. One time I said the correct name several times, and my boss continued to say the wrong one. I gave up. What rank is this consistent with?
Alpha would correct the boss immediately in public, Bravo in private, but either way would ensure he got the name right by making enough of an impression on him. Omega would be too scared to ever bother correcting, and Sigma too indifferent. Gamma would persist, and also complain to various third parties.
I have often heard y'all around here talk about "Delta with Gamma tendencies". But I have never heard anyone talk about "tendencies" toward any other kind of rank.
This makes me think that Delta<->Gamma would be more consistently described as a single thing which is a spectrum. Which would make Delta<->Gamma unique among the ranks, which is not very elegant, but still might be true.
On the other hand I also think "Sigma tendencies" and "Omega tendencies" seem credible. But I have never heard anyone else bring them up.
On the other other hand, "tendencies" don't totally make sense in a context in which your place in the hierarchy is determined intersubjectively. Like, the fact that you sometimes have Sigma thoughts while falling asleep makes no impact on how other people perceive you or instinctively rank you relative to themselves and others. And if SSH is seen as an analytical tool to predict human behaviors, well, only some of your behaviors are the kind of thing that anyone would be interested in predicting anyway, and your shower thoughts don't necessarily influence those specific behaviors.
Overall I guess what I find believable about Delta-Gamma is that there is a clear tension which seems true to life. You have a picture of a person, the "high road" available to him, and the "low road" available to him, and both are tempting. You have a personality that is capable of change over time.
What's hard to make sense of with Alphas, Bravos, and Sigmas is the idea implicit in this ranking system that their personality is SO set in stone that they have no significant internal tension. An Alpha will just... always be Alpha, because that's who he is. That is really hard to understand. Someone with no internal tension sounds like someone with no internal monologue - an NPC.
So I guess I'm saying, I think that Alphas and everyone else also experience internal tension. But it seems that only the Delta-Gamma range experience tension which is significant enough to affect their SSH position? Do Alphas experience no "Sigma temptation" or "Bravo temptation"? I dunno.
Please inform. Thank you.
> But I have never heard anyone talk about "tendencies" toward any other kind of rank.
Because it always ends up with gammas or deltas thinking they are alphas.
Bravos often find themselves in situational alpha roles for example.
Alphas also have internal tension. There is a high road and a low road for an Alpha. But a crap Alpha never falls into gamma tendencies.
Vox once wrote, either on Vox Popoli or Alpha Game, that he as a Sigma sometimes has to fight off Omega tendencies so he can be social. The anecdote he used was hanging out in the library by himself while his wife talked to the house guests. That is a more understandable example due to the similarities between Omega and Sigma.
As for Alphas, they will sometimes allow themselves to be relegated to a Bravo role if a more socially powerful Alpha shows up. Alphas don't like having to play "second banana" to a more dominant Alpha if they can avoid it, so you can call that a form of tension that arises situationally.
You need to read more. None of this is novel, and none of it describes the phenomena as presented.
I don't understand.
Seems to be a lot of self-inserting going on in the comments.
Reminds me of that doggerel Vox posted months ago: "The Incessant Inquiry".
Its funny because with the incessant inquiry what you almost always have is a horde of Gammas and Deltas asking what profile they are, when its obvious to everyone else.
Precisely. They're constantly trying to identify that one thing that allows them to suspect that they just might possibly be a Sigma. Or, previously, an Alpha.
It's so transparent.
These posts bring out the volunteerism this 'stack is famous for showing. Meaning for these kinds of posts:
Rule 1. Shut up.
Rule 2. Always follow Rule 1.
Occasionally there is the " it would be really nice if..." types of complaints.
Ive found in my own marriage humorous responses, sometimes even crude ones, will deflate the tension.
If its said with a smirk- it always works.
Early in the marriage there were occasional jealous outbursts after interactions that I had with other women.
I learned to just ignore them and as time passed they lessened.
The worst thing a guy can do in these situations is to be defensive or slavishly apologetic
It creates an emotional inferno
Interrogation 101: admit nothing. Especially if you're innocent.
By this example I’m 100% Sigma. When I first got together with my wife she had a terrible temper and would throw all these insults and accusations and more. Within a year I had completely broken her of these terrible emotional attacks. I retrained to not let herself become out of her mind emotionally angry. I got her to the point she would approach me and first tell me how she was emotionally upset and how it was completely illogical it was. Then she would either tell me directly what the real issue was or ask me to help her figure out what the real issue was. Her family was completely amazed I had tamed her often violent temper. As I cannot self define what I am I have no idea if others would see me as Sigma. It’s nothing I worry about but it is an interesting thought.
The fact that you sang a song once doesn't make you a bluebird. This is precisely why I don't do these things very often.
Because every retard then has to make it about himself. So tedious.
A pretty girl talked to me in high school. I'm clearly an Alpha.
Mega Alpha. Absolutely. Women want you and men want to be you.
The Gamma only stews about it for weeks? That’s an optimistic timeframe. Years later the Gamma will corner unwilling listeners to tell them this woeful tale of betrayal. A 2 second incident turns into a 20 minute story. “He knew damn well what my name was. He said it wrong on purpose because he’s afraid of me. He had to show everyone around him what a big man he was.”
Paranoia and the wall of text is a downfall of a gamma.
More of the SSH responses covering various scenarios please. This was enlightening as well as entertaining.
Not only no, but Hell no. I can't take the narcissistic retardery.
"I cut down a tree. Am I a Beaver?"
Gotcha and completely understand. I valued it for the exact opposite reason as it's helpful to understand how the various SSH would react to given situations, not to mention you're responses as a Sigma were hilarious.
I would be happy to pay you if it made the retardry a little easier to deal with
This post provoked a fascinating discussion between the two of us!
... I wondered if someone got paid regarding retardery.
I used to work in criminal justice. I realized right off that my paycheck was drawn on other people's stupidity.
Huh, I fit the Bravo category on both of these examples. Of course, that alone doesn't imply I'm a Bravo. But it's nice to know I definitely rise past the low/mid Delta in situations like these.
Nice! We need more Bravos. I think it is one of the most difficult SSH roles. Situational bravo is harder than situational alpha.
Is the Sigma the funniest rank in the hierarchy? Today's post supports that proposition.
Depends on who you are in the story. Using Hypergamouse as an example, none of the bosses found Dag anywhere near as funny as you or I.
The funniest character in Hypergamouse is Apex, which is true to life. Alphas are often effortlessly hilarious people.
Yeah, as readers of a comic we think it's funny, but IRL most of us would find a guy like Dag annoying as fuck.
Given that the Wall of Text is one of the favourite weapons of the Gamma, ChatGPT is probably a godsend for them.
I wonder if Gammas are more or less likely to use LLM's to generate their walls of text. Using them would allow for a higher throughput of wall, but not using them would show off their big brains.
Good point. After all they think too much of themselves and probably think they are superb writers.
Depending on the situation and the person I would immediately correct them or not care. I'm neither an Alpha or a Sigma, so there is definitely some overlap in the ranks
Is there is no minute imperceptible insignificant perceived slight of a Gamma that won't result in an excruciatingly detailed Wall of Text addressing every possible conceivable injustice one has supposedly committed?
In a spirit of sympathetic honesty, Gammas aren't always primed to recognize a slight or to go off, and that behavior can be subdued with continuing effort. They can also train themselves to make good of that impulse, as gatekeeping or defense of a friend.
But absent that ongoing self-controlling effort, the Gamma will go off given half an excuse; if no excuse can be found, he'll invent one.
I wonder how the different ranks would react to their longer term wives getting fat at some point down the road of life?
I pretty much agree with your take on that question and am very interested to hear Vox's take on how each rank would deal with that scenario.
Now this is where things get REALLY interesting. I'l give it a shot:
Omega: No wife (but if there happens to be one, she's been fat all the way).
Delta: Also get fat and end up as one of those fat grumpy non-communicating old couples.
Gamma: Cheat on her with some stupid online sugardaddy thing and get mad when she finds out.
Bravo: Pretend he loves it that way.
Sigma: Sigma wives don't get fat, monsieur.
Alpha: Already dumped her three years ago.
Bravos aren't afraid of conflict but the way they approach it is quite different to an Alpha.
They also don't have the delusion bubble some other ranks have. So they are unlikely to pretend they love it.
Best guess is he pressures her to exercise and eat better and makes compliance really easy. For example he will drive her to the gym and take the kids for an hour so she can exercise.
The phrase "selective enablement" popped into my head reading this. I'm going to have to chew on it.
Not true for a Bravo.
Bravos seem to accumulate attractive female friends, so the wife stays in shape, because she's worried that he'll divorce her for one of these friends, which is true, as his Alpha buddy will knock some sense back into him.
The Bravo would still probably try to communicate to his wife that she was fat and that he wanted to help her lose weight. If she reacted positively, then congrats, the Bravo's wife is losing weight. If she reacted negatively, then he would probably change his behavior and pretend to love it.
Gammas get scammed by those sites, but they rarely get anything more. They only really get the opportunity if they're in positions of prominence, like novel-writing Scientologist or director of feminist television programs.
Actually happened when a female friend was in a relationship with an affluent Gamma.
Why do you think this?
They have just as much of a want for it, but they don't get much drive out of it, perhaps?
I think Neil Gaiman would disagree.
The way I look at it, Gaiman's passive. He doesn't have the drive to go out and find a woman to be with; he waits for the fates to bring him someone vulnerable to prey upon.
It has nothing to do with the blog, but I don't know where else to ask my question.
How do you deal with a gamma that subjects you to interrogations and exclaims (uhh?!) with anger if you don't answer and that if you ask him a question he pretends that he didn't listen and moans again (uhh!?) so that you repeat what you said , I think it's a way to challenge you and make you angry or feel bad, thank you
It's easy. Stop talking to him. Just ignore him. It's the way you should handle everyone who refuses to accord others the respect they expect themselves.
“you never listen to me!” “you don’t love me!” “you never buy me anything! Do you even care?”
And then the Gamma calls her a slut and a whore and says "you probably loved being ran through by Chad and Connor and they didn't even care about you half as much as I do"
Trying to imagine what my Bravo husband would say if I brought up the fact (and it's true) that he doesn't bring me gifts and flowers. Probably something about how he gives me everything I need, plenty of money, and now I expect him to go pick something out and buy it for me, too?
That sounds more like the Delta response Vox wrote than the Bravo one, but if the Delta was not the type to give gifts.
Delta keeps tabs and is defensive. Bravo husband has frame and asserts dominance.
Usually I tolerate being called the wrong name once or twice and then correct it. One time I said the correct name several times, and my boss continued to say the wrong one. I gave up. What rank is this consistent with?
I think Delta.
Alpha would correct the boss immediately in public, Bravo in private, but either way would ensure he got the name right by making enough of an impression on him. Omega would be too scared to ever bother correcting, and Sigma too indifferent. Gamma would persist, and also complain to various third parties.
Thanks. That makes sense.