How do historical Sigmas like Pope Sixtus V, maybe Air Marshall Hugh Dowding, and more recent potential examples like Putin and Xi manage to stay within their large hierarchies and remain adequately successful as members in their earlier careers? How do they keep their Sigma behavior patterns from getting themselves ejected from the hierarchy before they are needed?
One of the best Popes ever. He had a lot of cleaning up to do after Gregory (of the Gregorian calendar fame) left the Vatican finances in shambles. His tomb is carved with soldiers carrying the severed heads of brigands, literally. Well worth a visit. We could use another Pope like him.
Fun Fact - Sixtus was alive when his memorial statue was commissioned, and he requested to be portrayed on his knees as a gesture of humility, versus sitting on the papal throne as was the case for some other popes. https://www.romeartlover.it/Vasi48a.html
I think it depends on whether he's being a clown just to amuse himself or if it's done as a way to grasp at social approval. Former would be sigma and latter would be gamma, IMO. Bart Simpson isn't a gamma, for example.
A rule of thumb I've discovered is: if a "type" is regularly celebrated in high school movies made after 1970, then the "type" is usually gamma IRL.
Because Hollywood studio writers since 1970 have been almost exclusively gamma, they do the self-insert thing, celebrating themselves as the heroes in their revenge re-writings of high school. Class clown figures in such movies are usually the "good" guys who's jokes are either super-meta, super-ironic, or super-witty (usually all three), so its a good bet its gamma.
Of course like all rules of thumb its not 100%. Sometimes a "class clown" figure in a film picks on the gamma-hero and embarrasses him. Generally, this class clown figure is depicted as the uglier friend of the alpha "jerk" the gamma-hero must defeat to win the girl. So in these circumstances, the class clown from the gamma's high school days wasn't a gamma, but a bravo or delta of the high school alpha.
Usually, though not necessarily, a Gamma. Can be Delta, probably not any higher. Although Owen is a Bravo and one assumes he was a class clown, but he was also a successful athlete. And a physical giant.
Remember, indirection and passive-aggression are Gamma behaviors.
In The Silmarilion, Feanor is a great fictional example of a tragic Sigma leader whose single-minded focus on one mission led to the destruction of himself and many others.
Tolkien contrasts him beautifully with his Alpha brother Fingolfin.
I wonder if the negative portrayal of the Sigma Feanor is an indicator that Tolkien was a Bravo. Bravos would be more offended by Sigmas than any other type would be.
He is extremely high-performing in personal and secretive projects, such as creating the Silmarils and other treasures.
While he is jealous for his kingship, as an Alpha would be, he doesn’t seem to care about it except as a means to his personal end of destroying Morgoth and regaining the Silmarils.
He does inspire the Noldor to follow him, but more out of his extreme oratorical skill than out of love for him personally. Tolkien mentions that most of the Noldor, including Galadriel, did not actually like him, but were nevertheless persuaded by his idea of the independent kingdoms they could build in Middle-Earth.
Even when he dies in the Battle Under Stars, it’s because he forgets about his people entirely and goes on ahead by himself to fight several Balrogs at once.
He shows no interest in women other than his wife Nerdanel, but she gives him seven sons (which is rare for Elves) who are absolutely devoted to him and his mission.
I'm not really convinced that Tolkien was against Sigma per se, but that it could be either good or bad... Túrin, Beren, and Gandalf all seem Sigma to me too, but with widely varying traits and fates.
The Catholic Church was in crisis. Sixtus had been a rigorous inquisitor in Venice -- to the point he was sacked. He reformed the structure of the Church and tidied up the accounts. He did not play the nepotistic games common in that era.
Disruptive reformers are only given power by acclaim when things are truly desperate.
Sixtus was a force of nature. The huge lavish art and architecture were for God and Church. His personal lifestyle was abstemious. The sincerity of mission is more confirmation. Julius Ii is similar. Most had a desire for aristocratic living in there somewhere, which is caring about social hierarchies.
Vox, what prompts a sigma to join a hierarchy? Is it really just a crises? Wouldn’t that be the one time the Sigma would never want to be part of the hierarchy?
Sigma’s are failsafes especially in crisis & especially in those crisis points where Alphas are deadlocked and/or in a position where the first Alpha who makes a move loses.
Sixtus' story illustrates the fallen nature of man very well. Specifically, Man is insanely ungrateful. At the beginning of his Papacy, there were bigtime problems with crime and brigandry. Obviously they were not amenable to being solved in the old traditional manner, because if they were, they'd have not been a problem. Sixtus cleaned the place up and probably reduced the bleeding from the Reformation. But notice he's hated at the end and only recognized again once he's safely in History.
This demonstrates how Ungrateful humans are, even those who are theologically supposed to embody gratitude (or perhaps especially them).
Papacy pre-Sixtus: broke, overrun by bandits, hemorrhaging authority around the world, literally crumbling
Papacy after: overflowing coffers, short something like a third of its bandits, restored infrastructure including running water, a stable organization
I had to combine several remarkably dismissive sources to get these details out, but it's striking how much he accomplished and how little love he holds to this day.
Humans just don't do gratitude. This is one of the things that drives the cycle of apostacy that the Old testament shows repeating again and again and again. Deltas though, in my experience, really like gratitude, even if it's just a pro forma thank you. They just rarely get it, probably why they like dogs so much.
Looking back, I'm realizing my childhood best friend was/is a complete sigma. He finished school half a year early so he could go be wrangler at a hunting camp in the literal middle of nowhere. Then when he came back he decided to go and become a professional bull rider. He pulled that off to a high enough degree that he made it into the Calgary stampeed a couple of times. None of his decisions made any sense to me but he made it work.
How do historical Sigmas like Pope Sixtus V, maybe Air Marshall Hugh Dowding, and more recent potential examples like Putin and Xi manage to stay within their large hierarchies and remain adequately successful as members in their earlier careers? How do they keep their Sigma behavior patterns from getting themselves ejected from the hierarchy before they are needed?
One of the best Popes ever. He had a lot of cleaning up to do after Gregory (of the Gregorian calendar fame) left the Vatican finances in shambles. His tomb is carved with soldiers carrying the severed heads of brigands, literally. Well worth a visit. We could use another Pope like him.
Fun Fact - Sixtus was alive when his memorial statue was commissioned, and he requested to be portrayed on his knees as a gesture of humility, versus sitting on the papal throne as was the case for some other popes. https://www.romeartlover.it/Vasi48a.html
Where in the SSH does the class clown fit?
I think it depends on whether he's being a clown just to amuse himself or if it's done as a way to grasp at social approval. Former would be sigma and latter would be gamma, IMO. Bart Simpson isn't a gamma, for example.
Class clowns are never Sigmas.
A rule of thumb I've discovered is: if a "type" is regularly celebrated in high school movies made after 1970, then the "type" is usually gamma IRL.
Because Hollywood studio writers since 1970 have been almost exclusively gamma, they do the self-insert thing, celebrating themselves as the heroes in their revenge re-writings of high school. Class clown figures in such movies are usually the "good" guys who's jokes are either super-meta, super-ironic, or super-witty (usually all three), so its a good bet its gamma.
Of course like all rules of thumb its not 100%. Sometimes a "class clown" figure in a film picks on the gamma-hero and embarrasses him. Generally, this class clown figure is depicted as the uglier friend of the alpha "jerk" the gamma-hero must defeat to win the girl. So in these circumstances, the class clown from the gamma's high school days wasn't a gamma, but a bravo or delta of the high school alpha.
Usually, though not necessarily, a Gamma. Can be Delta, probably not any higher. Although Owen is a Bravo and one assumes he was a class clown, but he was also a successful athlete. And a physical giant.
Remember, indirection and passive-aggression are Gamma behaviors.
So that's why Hollywood and recent Fantasy novels all have class clowns as the protagonist.
We need a "Sixtus the Sigma" shirt.
Putin?
https://open.substack.com/pub/sigmagame/p/ssh-and-geopolitics
In The Silmarilion, Feanor is a great fictional example of a tragic Sigma leader whose single-minded focus on one mission led to the destruction of himself and many others.
Tolkien contrasts him beautifully with his Alpha brother Fingolfin.
I wonder if the negative portrayal of the Sigma Feanor is an indicator that Tolkien was a Bravo. Bravos would be more offended by Sigmas than any other type would be.
I thought Feanor was Alpha?
Feanor is definitely a Sigma.
He is extremely high-performing in personal and secretive projects, such as creating the Silmarils and other treasures.
While he is jealous for his kingship, as an Alpha would be, he doesn’t seem to care about it except as a means to his personal end of destroying Morgoth and regaining the Silmarils.
He does inspire the Noldor to follow him, but more out of his extreme oratorical skill than out of love for him personally. Tolkien mentions that most of the Noldor, including Galadriel, did not actually like him, but were nevertheless persuaded by his idea of the independent kingdoms they could build in Middle-Earth.
Even when he dies in the Battle Under Stars, it’s because he forgets about his people entirely and goes on ahead by himself to fight several Balrogs at once.
He shows no interest in women other than his wife Nerdanel, but she gives him seven sons (which is rare for Elves) who are absolutely devoted to him and his mission.
That makes sense. Thanks.
I'm not really convinced that Tolkien was against Sigma per se, but that it could be either good or bad... Túrin, Beren, and Gandalf all seem Sigma to me too, but with widely varying traits and fates.
The Catholic Church was in crisis. Sixtus had been a rigorous inquisitor in Venice -- to the point he was sacked. He reformed the structure of the Church and tidied up the accounts. He did not play the nepotistic games common in that era.
Disruptive reformers are only given power by acclaim when things are truly desperate.
The greatest pope of all (except of course for St. Peter the Alpha) was an Omega. St. Celestine V.
>be hermit
>write letter to College of Cardinals berating them for failing to choose a pope after 2 years
>okay fine then hermit, you be pope
>fine okay fine
>enact a law that popes are allowed to resign
>resign
>get imprisoned by jealous successor
>die in prison
>canonized saint
St. Celestine, pray for us.
Sixtus was a force of nature. The huge lavish art and architecture were for God and Church. His personal lifestyle was abstemious. The sincerity of mission is more confirmation. Julius Ii is similar. Most had a desire for aristocratic living in there somewhere, which is caring about social hierarchies.
Vox, what prompts a sigma to join a hierarchy? Is it really just a crises? Wouldn’t that be the one time the Sigma would never want to be part of the hierarchy?
A sense of duty or a perception of a public need. But even when he takes action, the community may not agree or respond. See: Infogalactic.
when God tells him to
Leather books, of course!
Post SSH: I now understand why citizens would demand for a benevolent dictator which to mean a Sigma.
And he did all of that in 5 years.
Sigma’s are failsafes especially in crisis & especially in those crisis points where Alphas are deadlocked and/or in a position where the first Alpha who makes a move loses.
Sixtus' story illustrates the fallen nature of man very well. Specifically, Man is insanely ungrateful. At the beginning of his Papacy, there were bigtime problems with crime and brigandry. Obviously they were not amenable to being solved in the old traditional manner, because if they were, they'd have not been a problem. Sixtus cleaned the place up and probably reduced the bleeding from the Reformation. But notice he's hated at the end and only recognized again once he's safely in History.
This demonstrates how Ungrateful humans are, even those who are theologically supposed to embody gratitude (or perhaps especially them).
Papacy pre-Sixtus: broke, overrun by bandits, hemorrhaging authority around the world, literally crumbling
Papacy after: overflowing coffers, short something like a third of its bandits, restored infrastructure including running water, a stable organization
I had to combine several remarkably dismissive sources to get these details out, but it's striking how much he accomplished and how little love he holds to this day.
Humans just don't do gratitude. This is one of the things that drives the cycle of apostacy that the Old testament shows repeating again and again and again. Deltas though, in my experience, really like gratitude, even if it's just a pro forma thank you. They just rarely get it, probably why they like dogs so much.
That is a face that is ready for this sitting to be over so that he can resume his work.
I've a 16th century German's love for the papacy, but I can't help but respect the man.
Looking back, I'm realizing my childhood best friend was/is a complete sigma. He finished school half a year early so he could go be wrangler at a hunting camp in the literal middle of nowhere. Then when he came back he decided to go and become a professional bull rider. He pulled that off to a high enough degree that he made it into the Calgary stampeed a couple of times. None of his decisions made any sense to me but he made it work.