Vox makes very good points here about either practicing in a different group or just using women to raise your status. The latter would always work, but that is a tad ambitious. The former is a good start but the results from one group may not be translatable to another. What I might develop inside a new club or new church group may not apply to my, say, current corporate environment.
Let’s say you’re a gamma in a work or a school situation, something that is going to consume most of your day. You need to interact with the people around you but you know that your gammatude will decrease your margin of error with each social interaction that you have. You want to aim for your margin of error to remain intact so how do you go about doing this?
The step you take here is to benchmark and then cultivate the superficial. You’re observing the people around you, taking in how they look, talk, act and dress. You listen to their conversations, see what they watch or read, and note how they interact with each other. You then incorporate these actions into your own behavior, subtly mirroring the people around you. Your aim is to fit in with herd, so you need to emulate the herd as much as possible.
Focusing on this behavior, benchmarking the herd, naturally suppresses most if not all of your gamma tendencies, since the herd is mostly not gamma to begin with. If you successfully master this, then you will be able to interact with these people without damaging your margin of error.
Now, there is an important matter to address here. Some may not like what I’m suggesting because it is not “authentic.” It’s like putting on a mask and hiding your real self just to please others. After all, don’t we live in a society that insists how we are all unique individuals and that we should be able to be ourselves? Shouldn’t our own special uniqueness be celebrated?
To those who buy into this reasoning, you’ve bought into a trap. The push for individuality is to get people to advertise their faults so that they can be more easily screened out. Instead of forcing the other party to find your flaws, this cult of individuality lets you display your flaws for them. You broadcast your warts for all to see.
Why make life that easy for others?
After all, gammas are different. The problem is they are not better. What is the point of being different, if what makes you different does not make you better? Be better…don’t be gamma.
It’s equally important to note that this will be exhausting to many because you are going against your instinct. You will want to relapse to gamma because you will desperately want people to like you for what you really are.
Nonetheless, there is no “cheat” day. You are not allowed to let loose your gamma on occasion as some reward. Such action will be met very harshly and very negatively by the people around you. In fact, you will find it often astonishing how harsh it will inevitably be if you relapse. Maintain that discipline on an ongoing basis and it will become more natural and easier.
Let’s face it, gammas are not normal. Through some quirk of genetics and upbringing, gammas fall outside the norm. Its tendencies have to be fought against if you expect to live a normal life.
One final thought on Vox’s comment about Omega Journey dating a 6. Sometimes low-status men don’t want to be reminded of their low-status by dating low-status women. Equally, some men do not want to be treated like Ben Stiller’s character in There’s Something About Mary:
This is a separate problem from gammatude, but its an example of how men are treated by women at their own level of attractiveness and one of the main complaints of the manosphere. Most men are not complaining about not having hotties. They are complaining about rejection from women at their own level of attractiveness. If you are going to risk that kind of blowoff, it may as well be with a hottie.
I read "I would much rather be permanently celibate than have to hook up with a 6 out of some kind of desperation." and I laughed and then remembered all of the guys I have been acquainted with in the past who were like this. I always thought they were doing it just so they wouldn't have to compete with the men who were higher up SSH then them. In the 80% male mix that was the US Army signal battalion I served in while in Korea in the 90's, you got to see female hypergamy in full effect. It was an extremely competitive field for men *if they were restricting themselves to American women. I avoided the competition by dating civilian women, there was no reason to compete among all of my colleagues for the few women who were overseas with us. I had a cool little life off-base in Korea, not doing the stuff everyone else was doing when not training or out in the woods doing army things.
Does anybody got any data on the distribution of girls? I’m suspecting sixes are not only above average but occupying a band within the top 30% maybe 25%. I am assuming the values are not relative but individually adjust for aging and weight gain but conclude that the weighting of say fours in a population is much higher today versus the sixties or seventies.
Man, not even halfway theough this and the, "this is why Gammas look forward to high school, college, after college..offers a fresh start and new chance to become the true vision of themselves THEY IMAGINE THEMSELVES TO BE."
That right there, is one of the most intrinsic problems with the Gamma. The love the idea of themselves, but not the reality of themselves. The idea of themselves are always fluid and changing, they rarely know who they actually are. Either that, or they might have an idea of who they are, but pay it no attention cuz the idea of themselves is the bedrock of their self dillusion.
It doesn't matter what new opportunities come your way. Sure, it can be new and exciting, but wherever you go...there you are.
I was in a engineering major in hs. About 30 boys, of those 1 alpha, 1 bravo, 1 lamda, 3 deltas, the rest gammas. About 2 of these gammas tried to shake it off by joining the navy and the other joined air force.
Majority gammas bc they pre selected their own choice of major, a top engineering class at a highly competitive hs. Only smart bois that would argue with each other about physics and math. Only two boys had girlfriends: the alpha and the lamda. The lamda ended up being outed after graduating. They were all extremely angsty. The real 304's are the countless childless 30+ yr olds male and female. Those are the vile pos's convincing mtgow to become complete mental and antisocial eunuchs.
Vox just wants to sleep with this whore. And with his bald head is such a low status omega his only chance is by stoking her misandry against her husband with his false SSH theories and hearting her vile comments.
Is this a parody? Are you serious? Truth sting a bit much there, Smithers? Come on this is a parody, right? Do you ever listen to yourself? "Filthy bitchwhores"??
What is it in the Gamma that forces itself upon others like this? Classic Gamma tell here is your word usage and the attacks against our esteemed host (who really, REALLY doesn't care what you or any other Gamma thinks, ever). You cannot help yourself can you? Misandric? Wow. Yet again the taxonomy proves its truth. Thanks for the edification, Smithers.
I think this is just one guy with a host of fake accounts. Look at the language and speech patterns on the random trolls who have been banned in the last week or so.
Desperate Gamma who has been triggered so hard that Sigma Game is the Viagra to his hate boner.
The judgy omega recognizes he is often gazing upon surgically adjusted versions of women on screen. Even youthful girls get nose and chin work. There’s a semi old Chinese joke about a man that had such an ugly baby that he investigated his beautiful wife's history to discover that she was once upon a time shall we say an ugly baby, so he divorced her for fraud.
I can understand wanting to be celibate rather than settling for a 2/10 obese monstrosity. But 6’s are pleasant to look at. Even 5’s are, as well, assuming their average-ness does not extend to the appalling 160-pound weight average of Modern American Womyn.
Maybe she was, within the circle of women he was used to.
Also, it could be a matter of taste. Personally, I find that young Monica Bellucci does not even remotely compare to Grace Kelly, the ultimate 10, who makes Luthien and Helen of Troy look like potatoes.
I used to work in a retirement home when I was 17. The seniors would talk about 10's and would invoke names like Gina Lollobrigida, Raquel Welch etc. I recall looking them up and thinking world war 2 was tough. Those are beautiful women. I'm a millennial and gen Z types find our standards odd.
I think Hollywood has become dysgenic. You are likely to see prettier girls on a random city street than in a new Hollywood movie. They make a big deal about Sydney Sweeney these days, but she’s just a glorified 7 with large breasts.
I will say that Diane Kruger and Yvonne Strahovsky gave the earlier Hollywood blondes a run for their money.
Yes. And not just men. In Japan, my entire foreign class went to Roppongi just to verify for themselves that the model I was dating was real. And there were a few years when quite a few people in SF and SF fandom were insisting that Spacebunny wasn't real, that I'd just grabbed some model's picture and was claiming she was my wife.
Those are far from the only examples I could provide.
I was referencing the fact a high status male had to identify to other men that Vo’s had been with more girls than any of them had. So I was thinking deltas might be too selfish to notice that many women took a liking to Vox, but only the high status men who keep track of the pecking order would be the ones to notice. But “surprise” might be too strong of a word.
I think deltas are following a group thought, so confusion doesn't happen because they aren't really synthesizing for themselves, they accept the reality someone told them
If they were to synthesize for themselves theyd see someone doing fine and not look down on them, even though they aren't in the same circles.
Theyre not thinking but group thinking, which is not thinking.
The reason the SSH is such a big deal as a model is exactly because people haven't been reacting and learning, or this information would be wider known.
Ah, your question made it seem like the Sigma is surprised that women like him.
Yes, he triggers hate with his social aloofness. The haters agree he's a loser who doesn't belong. Then they are surprised when he shows up to the party with a top tier lady friend no one knows.
From the SSH definition post: "In a social situation, the sigma is the man who stops in briefly to say hello to a few friends accompanied by a tier-one girl that no one has ever seen before."
Since the Sigma is not part of their hierarchy, they miss out on opportunities to observe his sexual success, so there are surprises when they finally witness reality.
Why would marrying a 6 make you "desperate" if you yourself are a 3 or 4? You'd be out kicking your coverage, and likely would be blissfully happy. But wait, you'd be unhappy because she's not an 8? This is dyscivic in the extreme.
The original context of the statement is from this article https://omegasjourney.substack.com/p/take-it-or-leave-it/comments in which I describe how I am not desperate because I have a reduced sex drive and do not feel like marriage or sex would fulfill me. Please understand this is not a position most men can empathize with. Calling it dyscivic is kind of like calling someone with a broken leg lazy for not working more. As Vox says, the Omega disposition with women is often "borderline homicidal" or "indifferent".
I am sorry you feel that way, and I don't mean to insult you for that deficiency, but it is, by definition, dyscivic. A lack of desire to reproduce would have to be. I sincerely hope you can overcome that thorn.
Gammas and women have a hard time understanding- You cannot raise your status or get people to like you more by talking more. Try to STFU so people aren’t loathe to be around you. Zip it and don’t try to sabotage others. Work on yourself first, and then work on raising your status in the group as they slowly accept you back in.
For context I add that my statement is the product of an abnormal psycho-sexual development that leads to a reduced attraction and sex drive. In that sense it is like an actual insanity or disability of sorts.
The last paragraph is a great piece of advice. And there are gammas in history that a gamma male can look up to, such as C. S. Lewis. Most gammas would probably be happiest fitting into that box anyway, instead of trying to become someone that his personality prevents him from being.
" I would much rather be permanently celibate than have to hook up with a 6 out of some kind of desperation."
This highlights the Gammas' delusion bubble, as well as their Pride. I've hooked up with 6s, even dated one, because she was the pleasantest person I've ever known and easy to be with. It is absolutely deluded to think that it was in any way worse than being celibate and a civilizational dead end. Oh, wait, that's where the Pride comes in--sure, she'll make your life better, but other guys might look at you and think your girlfriend or wife "isn't that hot", so it's better to just do without. Cowards.
The frustrating thing is the dismissal of how much fun that 6 is, especially over nothing. They act like it is some kind of chore to carry out The Act.
I agree. Lust drove me down a wrong path, and I have been with beautiful women and ugly women. Sex feels the same with both. The only thing that makes it truly fun is how much the other woman is attracted to you, regardless of how she looks.
Her appearance gets you afterwards when you look at what you just slept with. It's all sin; the best thing is to get married to a woman who loves you. The grass is not greener on the other side.
Exactly. For a while I was resentful about the existence of lust. I didn't understand why God created it when it seemed to be the sole root of so many of mankind's problems. Eventually God granted me the realization that lust is the glue that holds a marriage together.
This is because lust makes a man weak for a woman, but it also makes a woman weak for a man. When both spouses feel lust for each other, they are weak for each other. They are more willing to come to agreements and try to make each other happy.
Where would men with high-functioning autism land on SSH? Omega, gamma or maybe low delta?
Vox makes very good points here about either practicing in a different group or just using women to raise your status. The latter would always work, but that is a tad ambitious. The former is a good start but the results from one group may not be translatable to another. What I might develop inside a new club or new church group may not apply to my, say, current corporate environment.
Let’s say you’re a gamma in a work or a school situation, something that is going to consume most of your day. You need to interact with the people around you but you know that your gammatude will decrease your margin of error with each social interaction that you have. You want to aim for your margin of error to remain intact so how do you go about doing this?
The step you take here is to benchmark and then cultivate the superficial. You’re observing the people around you, taking in how they look, talk, act and dress. You listen to their conversations, see what they watch or read, and note how they interact with each other. You then incorporate these actions into your own behavior, subtly mirroring the people around you. Your aim is to fit in with herd, so you need to emulate the herd as much as possible.
Focusing on this behavior, benchmarking the herd, naturally suppresses most if not all of your gamma tendencies, since the herd is mostly not gamma to begin with. If you successfully master this, then you will be able to interact with these people without damaging your margin of error.
Now, there is an important matter to address here. Some may not like what I’m suggesting because it is not “authentic.” It’s like putting on a mask and hiding your real self just to please others. After all, don’t we live in a society that insists how we are all unique individuals and that we should be able to be ourselves? Shouldn’t our own special uniqueness be celebrated?
To those who buy into this reasoning, you’ve bought into a trap. The push for individuality is to get people to advertise their faults so that they can be more easily screened out. Instead of forcing the other party to find your flaws, this cult of individuality lets you display your flaws for them. You broadcast your warts for all to see.
Why make life that easy for others?
After all, gammas are different. The problem is they are not better. What is the point of being different, if what makes you different does not make you better? Be better…don’t be gamma.
It’s equally important to note that this will be exhausting to many because you are going against your instinct. You will want to relapse to gamma because you will desperately want people to like you for what you really are.
Nonetheless, there is no “cheat” day. You are not allowed to let loose your gamma on occasion as some reward. Such action will be met very harshly and very negatively by the people around you. In fact, you will find it often astonishing how harsh it will inevitably be if you relapse. Maintain that discipline on an ongoing basis and it will become more natural and easier.
Let’s face it, gammas are not normal. Through some quirk of genetics and upbringing, gammas fall outside the norm. Its tendencies have to be fought against if you expect to live a normal life.
One final thought on Vox’s comment about Omega Journey dating a 6. Sometimes low-status men don’t want to be reminded of their low-status by dating low-status women. Equally, some men do not want to be treated like Ben Stiller’s character in There’s Something About Mary:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KTxjTrClRY
This is a separate problem from gammatude, but its an example of how men are treated by women at their own level of attractiveness and one of the main complaints of the manosphere. Most men are not complaining about not having hotties. They are complaining about rejection from women at their own level of attractiveness. If you are going to risk that kind of blowoff, it may as well be with a hottie.
To Gamma or Not to Gamma.
They are always Gonna Gamma, are they not?
I read "I would much rather be permanently celibate than have to hook up with a 6 out of some kind of desperation." and I laughed and then remembered all of the guys I have been acquainted with in the past who were like this. I always thought they were doing it just so they wouldn't have to compete with the men who were higher up SSH then them. In the 80% male mix that was the US Army signal battalion I served in while in Korea in the 90's, you got to see female hypergamy in full effect. It was an extremely competitive field for men *if they were restricting themselves to American women. I avoided the competition by dating civilian women, there was no reason to compete among all of my colleagues for the few women who were overseas with us. I had a cool little life off-base in Korea, not doing the stuff everyone else was doing when not training or out in the woods doing army things.
Does anybody got any data on the distribution of girls? I’m suspecting sixes are not only above average but occupying a band within the top 30% maybe 25%. I am assuming the values are not relative but individually adjust for aging and weight gain but conclude that the weighting of say fours in a population is much higher today versus the sixties or seventies.
It seems like the qualities that can be most destructive for an ssh rank can also be their strength, given some awareness and self control.
Gamma = Subject matter experts
Delta = Focus
Bravo = Apathy
Alpha = social dominance
Man, not even halfway theough this and the, "this is why Gammas look forward to high school, college, after college..offers a fresh start and new chance to become the true vision of themselves THEY IMAGINE THEMSELVES TO BE."
That right there, is one of the most intrinsic problems with the Gamma. The love the idea of themselves, but not the reality of themselves. The idea of themselves are always fluid and changing, they rarely know who they actually are. Either that, or they might have an idea of who they are, but pay it no attention cuz the idea of themselves is the bedrock of their self dillusion.
It doesn't matter what new opportunities come your way. Sure, it can be new and exciting, but wherever you go...there you are.
I was in a engineering major in hs. About 30 boys, of those 1 alpha, 1 bravo, 1 lamda, 3 deltas, the rest gammas. About 2 of these gammas tried to shake it off by joining the navy and the other joined air force.
Gamma confirmed. And banned.
Writing down a taxonomy about observable male behaviour is misandry?
By that logic, the FCI that categorizes dog breeds must be caninophobic.
Majority gammas bc they pre selected their own choice of major, a top engineering class at a highly competitive hs. Only smart bois that would argue with each other about physics and math. Only two boys had girlfriends: the alpha and the lamda. The lamda ended up being outed after graduating. They were all extremely angsty. The real 304's are the countless childless 30+ yr olds male and female. Those are the vile pos's convincing mtgow to become complete mental and antisocial eunuchs.
Vox just wants to sleep with this whore. And with his bald head is such a low status omega his only chance is by stoking her misandry against her husband with his false SSH theories and hearting her vile comments.
Maybe you should have a nice warm cup of camomile tea and a lie down. You'll feel much better afterwards.
???
Is this a parody? Are you serious? Truth sting a bit much there, Smithers? Come on this is a parody, right? Do you ever listen to yourself? "Filthy bitchwhores"??
What is it in the Gamma that forces itself upon others like this? Classic Gamma tell here is your word usage and the attacks against our esteemed host (who really, REALLY doesn't care what you or any other Gamma thinks, ever). You cannot help yourself can you? Misandric? Wow. Yet again the taxonomy proves its truth. Thanks for the edification, Smithers.
I think this is just one guy with a host of fake accounts. Look at the language and speech patterns on the random trolls who have been banned in the last week or so.
Desperate Gamma who has been triggered so hard that Sigma Game is the Viagra to his hate boner.
Misandric is not as bad as malandric.
The judgy omega recognizes he is often gazing upon surgically adjusted versions of women on screen. Even youthful girls get nose and chin work. There’s a semi old Chinese joke about a man that had such an ugly baby that he investigated his beautiful wife's history to discover that she was once upon a time shall we say an ugly baby, so he divorced her for fraud.
Does he even know what a 6 is?
I can understand wanting to be celibate rather than settling for a 2/10 obese monstrosity. But 6’s are pleasant to look at. Even 5’s are, as well, assuming their average-ness does not extend to the appalling 160-pound weight average of Modern American Womyn.
I read this somewhere from a guy like that. He wrote Monica Bellucci 90s was a 5.5. Some of these guys have very high standards.
Calling Monica Bellucci a 5.5 is an attempt at negging so exaggerated it's almost comical. And it's also a sure Gamma-tell.
Yeah, it’s either that or a man who is extremely used to dating 10s. She is a solid 8 as far as I can tell.
Maybe she was, within the circle of women he was used to.
Also, it could be a matter of taste. Personally, I find that young Monica Bellucci does not even remotely compare to Grace Kelly, the ultimate 10, who makes Luthien and Helen of Troy look like potatoes.
I'm willing to bet a not unsubstantial amount of money that the circle of women he was regularly surrounded by was mostly imaginary.
Yeah makes sense there's a generation gap.
I used to work in a retirement home when I was 17. The seniors would talk about 10's and would invoke names like Gina Lollobrigida, Raquel Welch etc. I recall looking them up and thinking world war 2 was tough. Those are beautiful women. I'm a millennial and gen Z types find our standards odd.
I think Hollywood has become dysgenic. You are likely to see prettier girls on a random city street than in a new Hollywood movie. They make a big deal about Sydney Sweeney these days, but she’s just a glorified 7 with large breasts.
I will say that Diane Kruger and Yvonne Strahovsky gave the earlier Hollywood blondes a run for their money.
Hottest 40yo ever-Goldie Hawn
Settle down, Boomer.
Is it a sigma thing for men to be surprised how much women actually like you?
Yes. And not just men. In Japan, my entire foreign class went to Roppongi just to verify for themselves that the model I was dating was real. And there were a few years when quite a few people in SF and SF fandom were insisting that Spacebunny wasn't real, that I'd just grabbed some model's picture and was claiming she was my wife.
Those are far from the only examples I could provide.
If its surprising it doesn't happen often.
I was referencing the fact a high status male had to identify to other men that Vo’s had been with more girls than any of them had. So I was thinking deltas might be too selfish to notice that many women took a liking to Vox, but only the high status men who keep track of the pecking order would be the ones to notice. But “surprise” might be too strong of a word.
I also misunderstood you.
I think deltas are following a group thought, so confusion doesn't happen because they aren't really synthesizing for themselves, they accept the reality someone told them
If they were to synthesize for themselves theyd see someone doing fine and not look down on them, even though they aren't in the same circles.
Theyre not thinking but group thinking, which is not thinking.
The reason the SSH is such a big deal as a model is exactly because people haven't been reacting and learning, or this information would be wider known.
Ah, your question made it seem like the Sigma is surprised that women like him.
Yes, he triggers hate with his social aloofness. The haters agree he's a loser who doesn't belong. Then they are surprised when he shows up to the party with a top tier lady friend no one knows.
From the SSH definition post: "In a social situation, the sigma is the man who stops in briefly to say hello to a few friends accompanied by a tier-one girl that no one has ever seen before."
Since the Sigma is not part of their hierarchy, they miss out on opportunities to observe his sexual success, so there are surprises when they finally witness reality.
Well said, Sir Hamster. Seen that happen more than once.
From the few examples I've seen, not really. I've seen mild irritation and amusement, but never anything hinting at surprise.
A 6 isn't good enough? Delusional.
Wow. I can remember being a sailor. We didn't use 1 through 10. There was only 1 or 0. And to quote a friend, "0 is a vanishingly small number."
You can have a great time with a girl that is moderately easy on the eyes and in a good mood.
This is true
Why would marrying a 6 make you "desperate" if you yourself are a 3 or 4? You'd be out kicking your coverage, and likely would be blissfully happy. But wait, you'd be unhappy because she's not an 8? This is dyscivic in the extreme.
The original context of the statement is from this article https://omegasjourney.substack.com/p/take-it-or-leave-it/comments in which I describe how I am not desperate because I have a reduced sex drive and do not feel like marriage or sex would fulfill me. Please understand this is not a position most men can empathize with. Calling it dyscivic is kind of like calling someone with a broken leg lazy for not working more. As Vox says, the Omega disposition with women is often "borderline homicidal" or "indifferent".
I am sorry you feel that way, and I don't mean to insult you for that deficiency, but it is, by definition, dyscivic. A lack of desire to reproduce would have to be. I sincerely hope you can overcome that thorn.
Gammas and women have a hard time understanding- You cannot raise your status or get people to like you more by talking more. Try to STFU so people aren’t loathe to be around you. Zip it and don’t try to sabotage others. Work on yourself first, and then work on raising your status in the group as they slowly accept you back in.
For context I add that my statement is the product of an abnormal psycho-sexual development that leads to a reduced attraction and sex drive. In that sense it is like an actual insanity or disability of sorts.
Is it necessary to pathologize it? Everybody took their own lumps coming up.
The last paragraph is a great piece of advice. And there are gammas in history that a gamma male can look up to, such as C. S. Lewis. Most gammas would probably be happiest fitting into that box anyway, instead of trying to become someone that his personality prevents him from being.
" I would much rather be permanently celibate than have to hook up with a 6 out of some kind of desperation."
This highlights the Gammas' delusion bubble, as well as their Pride. I've hooked up with 6s, even dated one, because she was the pleasantest person I've ever known and easy to be with. It is absolutely deluded to think that it was in any way worse than being celibate and a civilizational dead end. Oh, wait, that's where the Pride comes in--sure, she'll make your life better, but other guys might look at you and think your girlfriend or wife "isn't that hot", so it's better to just do without. Cowards.
The problem is that he sees it as desperation instead of an acceptance of reality.
The frustrating thing is the dismissal of how much fun that 6 is, especially over nothing. They act like it is some kind of chore to carry out The Act.
I agree. Lust drove me down a wrong path, and I have been with beautiful women and ugly women. Sex feels the same with both. The only thing that makes it truly fun is how much the other woman is attracted to you, regardless of how she looks.
Her appearance gets you afterwards when you look at what you just slept with. It's all sin; the best thing is to get married to a woman who loves you. The grass is not greener on the other side.
I think like the SSH itself. Physical attraction was also designed by God and is Good. Part of the original design.
In accordance with the Trinity of Goodness,Truth and Beauty. But messed up by sin.
Exactly. For a while I was resentful about the existence of lust. I didn't understand why God created it when it seemed to be the sole root of so many of mankind's problems. Eventually God granted me the realization that lust is the glue that holds a marriage together.
This is because lust makes a man weak for a woman, but it also makes a woman weak for a man. When both spouses feel lust for each other, they are weak for each other. They are more willing to come to agreements and try to make each other happy.
I wouldn't call it Lust. But healthy Eroticism especially when it is in the right context.
Lust is an abnormal and misbegotten distortion of an otherwise healthy physical desire.
You're right. I mean sexual arousal generally, although I tend to think it should be as strong as possible between spouses.